Nick Jackson (2) Posted October 18, 2008 Share Posted October 18, 2008 Is it easy to swap a PAS rack for a manual one? My PAS rack is leaking and I've had about 3 of these in 11 years of Triumph ownership. I'm think of giving up on PAS and going with manual for simplicity! Only problem is the potential heavy steering, especially as I've got some modern wider alloys.Any views on switching PAS to manual?Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy thompson Posted October 18, 2008 Share Posted October 18, 2008 Done it for similar reasons on an old 2500 many years ago... You need the crossmember, the complete steering coupling, obviously a rack, preferably TR4/Herald alloy clamps... optional spitfire 7 tooth pinion gear will give heavy steerring but good ratio. 3.25:1 versus 4.25:1 You also should need the steering arms off the hub (PAS ones are marked P) I still use PAS ones on my current Mk1 but have made other geometry mods.If you have good new tyres and good geometry you will find once up to cruise the steering is nice but parking will be a strain if you are used to PAS... you notice good feel/feedpack particularly when powering out of roundabouts etc that is entirely absent from PAS... you very quickly get used to this and not notice t unless you go back to PAS!!! I regularly drive both non PAS and PAS and only really notice the lack of assistance in the first few miles. You also lose about 15 kilos!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shedmonkey Posted October 18, 2008 Share Posted October 18, 2008 agree with Andy you get used to no PAS very quickly and it feels great! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astwood Autos Posted October 18, 2008 Share Posted October 18, 2008 Go for it! My P.I BWK 14K is manual steering and gives much better feel at speed than pas. Prime example being the recent RBRR, much better to drive on the twisty sections!! My co-driver Bradley is used to moderns with power steering and he didn't complain, well not that I heard anyway! Tad heavy at parking speeds but I do have 15" Minilites so only to be expected. Worthwhile modification in my book! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJB_Harvey Posted October 18, 2008 Share Posted October 18, 2008 My view is to ditch the PAS on saloons ,they are far better to drive without it...go for the mods that Andy recommends AND fit CW roller bearing strut tops.....once done you will never revert back . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Sorbington Posted October 18, 2008 Share Posted October 18, 2008 You do lose a little bit of feel with PAS but I think it's worth it for the quicker rack and reduced effort, the car is far more responsive, and easier to catch should you end up going sideways :). I always preferred my PAS 2000 to my non assisted one.I can see your point about cheaper steering racks though and they're still nice to drive without it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jackson (2) Posted October 18, 2008 Author Share Posted October 18, 2008 If the PAS rack is shot in any case, then it seems it better to spend on the manual rack + associated parts. Thanks. Will investigate and schedule the work in for the autumn program! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeyb Posted October 18, 2008 Share Posted October 18, 2008 I'm in the process of going the opposite way (manual to PAS) - mainly to reduce the no of turns lock to lock and to allow Ivi to drive (and park!). Also cos I just happen to have all the bits!It's worthy of note that manual to PAS is a lot more involved than the other way as you must change the engine front plate and bits like rad hoses, pulley, fan, crossmember are all different. To go the other way, you just leave on those bits you already have! Can't you bolt a manual rack to a PS X-member? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Sorbington Posted October 18, 2008 Share Posted October 18, 2008 I really think PAS is better.Do you really need to change the engine front plate? It must be possible to use a little imagination and fabricate some pump mounting brackets from another point on the engine. Just ensure that the pump is aligned with the pulley (you need a double pulley) and has some adjustment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Sorbington Posted October 18, 2008 Share Posted October 18, 2008 Richard, check that tape is holding up..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jackson (2) Posted October 18, 2008 Author Share Posted October 18, 2008 How about taking another view on this problem.Is it possible to find a supplier who can supply me with a GOOD QUALITY reconcditioned or new PAS steering rack that will last more than 2 or 3 years AND also give me more feel to the steering? If so, I'd be happier to pay out on a new PAS rack. That said, my general motto is the simpler the better.Currently, my steering is much too light and it's difficult to keep the car from wandering at high speed. Maybe that's a sympton of a failing/leaky rack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Sorbington Posted October 18, 2008 Share Posted October 18, 2008 My PAS 2000 estate was nice to drive at speed, felt no different to the manual steering car, but was so much more agile around town, mini roundabouts etc, and easy to park, not always true of the non PAS saloon! Stag racks make the steering too light (ask Chatterton) and having the correct link arms is important too apparently.Unfortunately, you're dealing with ancient PAS technology so leaks and limited lifespan are inevitable, I'd try Chris Witor, not the cheapest but probably as good as you'll get. Fitchetts do a re-con rack for 125 pounds sterling but make sure they're not selling you a Stag one.At 45 quid, a recon manual rack will last forever with a bit of maintenance but life's luxuries always come at a price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heraldhabitat Posted October 18, 2008 Share Posted October 18, 2008 Nick PM sent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted October 18, 2008 Share Posted October 18, 2008 I dislike the lack of feel with PAS - and don't understand the issues with manual being any more difficult.I've just done exactly what Andy suggests - quick rack with alloy clamps. Only moved it in and out the parking space (which is about as extreme as it gets) - and it was a tiny bit heavier but keep the car moving as you should and no problem at all.Can't wait to test it out on the open road tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Bancroft Posted October 19, 2008 Share Posted October 19, 2008 Only driven one big saloon with PAS, ugh!Give me a manual rack anytime.Nick:Why not have a chat with Mikey B and see if he'd sell the stuff he is taking off the car.My car has the Witor roller bearing top struts-superb, they enable the car to be accurately placed on the road. I must say I have found Chris' parts to be very good, maybe a bit pricier, but worth at as one knows the quality will be there. Too many people in the Triumph world are always looking for cheap prices, the manufacturers therefore sell poor quality parts, and then we moan when they do not last. I have no issues with paying for quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Bancroft Posted October 19, 2008 Share Posted October 19, 2008 Only driven one big saloon with PAS, ugh!Give me a manual rack anytime.Nick:Why not have a chat with Mikey B and see if he'd sell the stuff he is taking off the car.My car has the Witor roller bearing top struts-superb, they enable the car to be accurately placed on the road. I must say I have found Chris' parts to be very good, maybe a bit pricier, but worth at as one knows the quality will be there. Too many people in the Triumph world are always looking for cheap prices, the manufacturers therefore sell poor quality parts, and then we moan when they do not last. I have no issues with paying for quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greeks Posted October 19, 2008 Share Posted October 19, 2008 I normally hate it too ... but I really don't mind it on the 'S' - it's nowhere near as floaty as normal PAS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted October 19, 2008 Share Posted October 19, 2008 Agree on the cheapness thing - Witor sells two versions of his rack mounts. When I asked the difference it was obvious what to go for.The strut bearings might be my next upgrade as I've made the steering a bit harder now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeyb Posted October 19, 2008 Share Posted October 19, 2008 timbancroft61 wrote:Nick:Why not have a chat with Mikey B and see if he'd sell the stuff he is taking off the car.If I'm correct in thinking that the manual rack will bolt to a PAS X-member, then all you actually will need is the rack and clamps, steering coupling to column and the link arms for the backs of the hubs. All the rest of the PAS specific stuff such as rad hoses, pulley, front plate, fan etc can be left in place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Keys Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 I cant even start to imagine why you would take PAS off a car? To save weight i binned the engine instead and fitted a Rover V8. This is how to make your car handle!Plenty of feel through the steering, but you do need to set up your geo properly. I fitted some of chris witors increased castor bushes and this helped.Ok, im biased, but i love the way mine drives, kind of modern in feel. I drove alex's car on the RBRR with no PAS. No way would i go back to that. So, heavy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jackson (2) Posted October 20, 2008 Author Share Posted October 20, 2008 Quote:I cant even start to imagine why you would take PAS off a car?Because she wanders over the road like a drunken sailor and leaks when misbehaving! Will speak to that Witor fella and decide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shedmonkey Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 roger_keys wrote:I cant even start to imagine why you would take PAS off a car? To save weight i binned the engine instead and fitted a Rover V8. This is how to make your car handle!Plenty of feel through the steering, but you do need to set up your geo properly. I fitted some of chris witors increased castor bushes and this helped.Ok, im biased, but i love the way mine drives, kind of modern in feel. I drove alex's car on the RBRR with no PAS. No way would i go back to that. So, heavy! you big girl! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Keys Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 97679 wrote:Because she wanders over the road like a drunken sailor and leaks when misbehaving! Will speak to that Witor fella and decide. Then its broken, and needs mending and aligning. You wouldn't revert to an open fire in one room cos your central heating boiler broke down? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Keys Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 ajp wrote:you big girl! :)You may think that but i like my cars to perform, not be burdened with handicaps like manual steering and boat anchors over the front axle ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard B Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 roger_keys wrote:You may think that but i like my cars to perform, not be burdened with handicaps like manual steering and boat anchors over the front axle ;)But it is a boat anchor that says STANPART :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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