Herald Rear Spring

[G8HSV]

I have not had my Herald long and took it out to a local show last week cos the Vitesse is in many, many pieces.  I happened to park next to a nice Herald Coupe.  I noticed that my Herald sits much higher on the road and the rear wheel are cambered in at the bottom quite a lot.  It has had a new spring fitted recently....it looks relatively new too and the diff cover is not attached properly.  I am now thinking that the wrong spring may have been fitted.  I noticed from the catalogues that the Herald/Vitesse seem to have the same spring but that there are several fitted to the Spitfire range.  I assume they are the same fitment (size wise) but may be different strength?
Also are there any ID marks to confirm the correct one?
I have attached a pic...which shows how many leaves ....

[Casper]

I think I can count 10, so I guess you have 11 leaves.  So it could be a Vitesse spring or one from a Herald saloon or convertible.  The springs differ between each model as to their free arc height and spring rate.  e.g. the Mk II Vitesse spring is taller, but softer.
As standard, the Herald saloon/Cv should have about 2 degrees negative camber on the back in the LADEN condition.  (I am currently running about 2 or 3 deg Positive without problems).
You could add a spring spacer (usual suspects) which would raise the spring and take the camber more negative.
If you have access to the TSSC Courier CD there is a brilliant series of articles in Aug, Sept and Oct 1993.  'Suspect Suspensions Sussed' by Carl Heinlein.  Highly recommended and you would learn a lot.
One thing to check first, though.  Does it sit higher or lower if you reverse to a stop, or drive forward to a stop.  If the rear toe in (or out) is incorrect it can 'jack' the car up.
As long as it doesn't look silly, or you get lairy handling when driven hard into corners, I wouldn't get too upset.
The best advice I can give, as the car is new to you, is to get a full suspension and alignment check from a specialist who can do full 4 wheel alignment.  Only then will you really know what you are dealing with.  The disappointing thing is that most of these specialists will not adjust the suspensions on our cars, except front toe (all) and rear toe on rotoflex.  Jigsaw can do these checks and i guess they will also do the adjustments (NFI).

C.
C.

[Clive]

Good points above. I think the herald/vitesse spring is about the strongest. I would say that unless you want to complicate things, a spring lowering block is the way forward. Of course it may be that the rear trunnions are a little sezed, which wont help either. Load the car up, give the suspension a good workout, it may help. If not, lower is a bit.
Toe can be done at home using two bits of (straight) wood, although I now use box section steel, some bricks and a tape measure. But the car needs to have a load in the front, and be level and settled,

[G8HSV]

I had reversed into the parking area so yes the wheels had tucked in as normal.  However the car at the side of mine had also reversed in and sat squatter.  see pic ...although you cant see my wheels the whole car is sat higher (and the ground was level).  I would like to compare heights with my Vitesse but it is quite a way off being ready for the road.
It is now parked on the drive and was driven on forwards and the wheels are still tucked in.  

Casper...thanks for the Courier tip...I have the CD and will check it out........

I suspect it has just had a 'Herald' spring fitted by a previous owner...not realising there were differences (I didnt!).  How can they be identified?  Do they have different number of leaves?

[heraldcoupe]

The wheels shouldn't tuck in when you reverse, that's a certain sign that the rear tracking is pigeon toed.

As standard, the Coupe will have a lower stance than a Herald Saloon or Convertible, that's by design, not by accident. There are many different Herald springs, the Coupe spring has only eight leaves, and quite light ones at that.

Getting the exact specification right with reproduction springs is a minefield. A whole year's production is likely to be at the scale that Standard Triumph would consider a test sample. That doesn't give much scope for adjustment once a batch is in progress,

Cheers,
Bill.

[Casper]

Quote:

The wheels shouldn't tuck in when you reverse, that's a certain sign that the rear tracking is pigeon toed.

I think you have toe OUT on the rear.
Drive forward to a stop and sight along the outside of the rear tyres.  You should be able to see about an inch (or the first block of tread) of the front tyres.
I bet you can't!
C.

[G8HSV]

I have acquired a secondhand spring which measures has 11 leaves at .219 thickness.  Can I remove the top 3 leaves and make it into a Coupé spring or is it not so simple.  That should have the effect of lowering the car slightly?

[G8HSV]

An Update.

Finally got round to looking at the Herald.  The offside rear trunnion is seized and the n/s U/J is knocking. So whilst the car is on stands I removed the rear spring...much easier than I thought.

The new spring I acquired has the number 305945 stamped on it (seems from Canleys/Rimmers this is correct for Herald Saloon.  The spring which was on the car is stamped 303727 which is not on anyones list so I'm not sure where that came from.  It looks i   I will fit the 305945 and hopefully all will be sorted.

[heraldcoupe]

303727 is the original spring for earlyier Herald and Vitesse 6 Saloons.
305495 was originally the Convertible spring, but it was fitted to late saloons, from commission number GA223682 onwards in the case of the Heralds. Poundage and blade thicknesses are the same, but this one should give slightly greater negative camber according to the original specification,

Cheers,
Bill.

[G8HSV]

Thanks for the info, Bill.  I couldn't find any reference to the 303727 but as its en early Herald it must be the original and just been cleaned up.

Anyway spring refitted, trunnions sorted and wheels look much better and don't tuck in on reversing.

Now .... on to the front brake hoses in my other post..